No one, when writing about any of the Abrahamic belief systems, seems to get the concept that the God of those systems is fundamentally beyond human understanding. Kinda like the universe in fact. If the deity of the Old Testament is “King of the Universe,” and there are most stars in that universe than there are grains of sand on all the beaches on earth, isn’t any attempt to understand that deity presumptuous beyond description?
Have you ever read "Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance" by Robert Pirsig? It posits that "Quality" (roughly equivalent to Plato's Good) is the fundamental basis of reality. I had to read the book five times and conduct additional research on science and philosophy before I felt I fully understood it. Anyway, the author finds justification for religious belief and practice, but not for faith, which is a component of many religions but is not essential to religion.
Stupid question on my part, but: do you have to know a lot about motorcycles or their maintenance to understand and enjoy that book? I ask because I've heard of that book for years, but have shied away from reading it because I'm not into motorcycles.
Again, that may be a foolish question. It's probably not to hard just to read the darned thing and see for myself.
I have been into motorcycles (not Harleys) from well before I read Pirsig, who is, in my opinion, not knowledgeable about motorcycles at all, except from maintenance task manuals. I found his philosophy similarly derivative, not in a good way.
You don't have to know anything about motorcycles to understand the book. The basic idea behind the book is that there is an esthetic element to all human knowledge that unifies art, religion, and science. Motorcycle maintenance is simply used as an example. Pirsig also wrote a sequel, "Lila," that develops his philosophy further.
The problem, or perhaps my problem, is that once you've broken away from whatever religion you were raised in, irrespective of the reason you broke away, all religions seem suspect.
I sympathize with Jacobs’ view, but it’s walking a tricky line and could backfire spectacularly. Once you’ve determined that Christianity is this unique and uniquely true thing among religions, you’ve got nowhere to go if you start doubting it. In that respect, Douthat’s book could be helpful to seekers, but it’s tough for me not to see his whole project as somewhat disingenuous. Conservative Christians don’t even like progressive Christians, let alone Hindus and Buddhists.
I have a hard time believing that he’d be happy for someone raised nominally Christian to fully embrace a traditionally eastern religion. I think his goal is for people to take another look at the religion that’s “closest” to them in terms of their ancestry/family history, and for a lot of Americans that would be Christianity. But it’s all being framed in this sort of, “I’m open to whatever you decide!” kind of way, as if there isn’t a correct answer that he wants you to get to.
I would guess he considers Judaism to be subsumed by Christianity as its precursor, perhaps a kind of smoothed over ground floor for Christianity. It would therefore not require independent consideration. Also, he seems to be recommending the heavy hitters numerically. Judaism is not in that league.
No one, when writing about any of the Abrahamic belief systems, seems to get the concept that the God of those systems is fundamentally beyond human understanding. Kinda like the universe in fact. If the deity of the Old Testament is “King of the Universe,” and there are most stars in that universe than there are grains of sand on all the beaches on earth, isn’t any attempt to understand that deity presumptuous beyond description?
I mean, that's certainly the tack the voice from the whirlwind takes in Job, my favorite Biblical book.
Guess you gotta put out SOME words every once in a whle.
Sorry I wasted my time here.
Have you ever read "Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance" by Robert Pirsig? It posits that "Quality" (roughly equivalent to Plato's Good) is the fundamental basis of reality. I had to read the book five times and conduct additional research on science and philosophy before I felt I fully understood it. Anyway, the author finds justification for religious belief and practice, but not for faith, which is a component of many religions but is not essential to religion.
Stupid question on my part, but: do you have to know a lot about motorcycles or their maintenance to understand and enjoy that book? I ask because I've heard of that book for years, but have shied away from reading it because I'm not into motorcycles.
Again, that may be a foolish question. It's probably not to hard just to read the darned thing and see for myself.
I have been into motorcycles (not Harleys) from well before I read Pirsig, who is, in my opinion, not knowledgeable about motorcycles at all, except from maintenance task manuals. I found his philosophy similarly derivative, not in a good way.
You don't have to know anything about motorcycles to understand the book. The basic idea behind the book is that there is an esthetic element to all human knowledge that unifies art, religion, and science. Motorcycle maintenance is simply used as an example. Pirsig also wrote a sequel, "Lila," that develops his philosophy further.
Thanks!
The problem, or perhaps my problem, is that once you've broken away from whatever religion you were raised in, irrespective of the reason you broke away, all religions seem suspect.
There are those, like Douthat in a sense, who move from one religion to another (in his case from one branch of Christianity to another).
I sympathize with Jacobs’ view, but it’s walking a tricky line and could backfire spectacularly. Once you’ve determined that Christianity is this unique and uniquely true thing among religions, you’ve got nowhere to go if you start doubting it. In that respect, Douthat’s book could be helpful to seekers, but it’s tough for me not to see his whole project as somewhat disingenuous. Conservative Christians don’t even like progressive Christians, let alone Hindus and Buddhists.
I have a hard time believing that he’d be happy for someone raised nominally Christian to fully embrace a traditionally eastern religion. I think his goal is for people to take another look at the religion that’s “closest” to them in terms of their ancestry/family history, and for a lot of Americans that would be Christianity. But it’s all being framed in this sort of, “I’m open to whatever you decide!” kind of way, as if there isn’t a correct answer that he wants you to get to.
I got as far as the list of the world’s major religions. I guess Judaism no longer counts? I stopped reading.
Douthat, for whatever reason, barely talks about Judaism — my own tradition — in his book.
Mine as well. It’s difficult at times to live in a world lead by Christian white males.
Eh -- could be worse. Could be a world led by Aztecs.
I would guess he considers Judaism to be subsumed by Christianity as its precursor, perhaps a kind of smoothed over ground floor for Christianity. It would therefore not require independent consideration. Also, he seems to be recommending the heavy hitters numerically. Judaism is not in that league.